David Capes
There’s a number of historians, even if they don’t believe that Jesus rose from the dead physically, they grant that something remarkable happened at that particular point. They can’t bring themselves to see or to understand this miraculous side of it. But it’s hard to deny that something astounding happened. Otherwise, it’s difficult to explain the rapid explosion of the church in the first years.
Gary Habermas
Sure, I think you’re definitely right. When I was in grad school, Rudolf Bultmann was easily head and shoulders above every other New Testament scholar, and it seemed like most New Testament scholars were either hanging on to him or reacting against him. He was just huge. To go back to your point that something really happened, Rudolf Bultmann was there. In fact, in his 1941 essay New Testament Mythology, which started the New Testament world on demythologization, he says the resurrection didn’t occur. But he also said, it cannot be protested that the earliest disciples had experiences, real experiences that they thought were appearances of the risen Jesus. And if Bultmann says it we’re off
and running. We can put the stuff on the table and talk about it, and they’ll say, you’re taking it too easy. And I’ll say you’re not living up to the data you’ve already admitted. So that’s how it works.
David Capes
So that’s how minimal facts works, and how you put together the evidence to support those minimal facts, or those six facts. And is that represented in your first volume?
Gary Habermas
Yes, the evidence is in volume 1 and volume 2, which we’re hoping will be out before the lecture in November. And volume 2 is our natural theories. That book is about 900 pages. It’s a little bit shorter but trying to entertain every critical theory you can think of. When you combine the two volumes, this event is highly evidenced. That’s why nobody disputes the facts. But it’s way more important that that the facts are there. Not that tomorrow, all the critics may not agree with it anymore, but the data is still going to be there. That’s the most important. That’s why the two volumes go together, facts and answering critics. Those are the first 2 of 4 volumes.
David Capes
What are the other two volumes? I know you have that scoped out and planned out. What is volume 3 going to be about?
Gary Habermas
I did my dissertation back in 1976 when I was 25 years old. I was wet behind the ears and I thought, people would want to know what this guy from a state university says in his dissertation on the resurrection. They’re going to want to know how I got it to pass this committee. So I better start working on it. And about 25 years later, I thought I better stop and do an update on my bibliography. Just for myself I started putting together a bibliography of what the leading New Testament theologians, Scripture scholars, non-Christian philosophers, and historians say and this thing got very long, very fast.
I had 1500 pages of material. All I did was say, what does Reginald Fuller, Richard Bauckham, and John Dominic Crossan say? I was going to do three volumes of the set, and someone said to me, why not put your notes out there? Everything you got together doing this headcount. And I thought, that looks good. So volume 3, I think, is going to be well used.
Maybe it’s going to mostly be used by MA and PhD students who want a reference volume for where people are on everything from the interrogation of Jesus prior to his crucifixion, to the ascension. Then they’re also going to want to talk about, what it means, theologically, what does this mean for presentations of the gospel today? But also, what does it mean for involvement with poor people and helping meet needs? What’s the resurrection? Paul relates it to working with the poor, and so did others. You look up the topic, and then you look at the range of views from evangelical to Rudolph Bultmann.
Gary Habermas
It’s a “who’s who,” and a what’s what. I make very few comments. I’m telling people where scholars are on the topic. It’s kind of a running dialog between scholars, but I’m not one of the dialoguers.
David Capes
You know, those kinds of things are valuable as history of the study of the New Testament, its focus for scholars in their masters and PhD level. Because it gives them a history of where scholarship has been on this particular topic, which is arguably, if not the most important, pretty close to the very top.
Gary Habermas
Volume four is on theology and practice. I start with, how do we establish a Christian worldview based on the resurrection? Because that’s obviously what the people did in the New Testament. They started with the resurrection, and they built this big agenda and worldview. And then after the worldview question, I go on to practice questions. What does the resurrection say to people like me who lost a spouse when they were young and don’t know what to do? What does it say to people who are old and they’ve been told they don’t have long to live. What are their thoughts about the afterlife going to be? What does the resurrection say to death and dying?
That’s where I try to tie in the resurrection for the second half of the volume. And the fourth volume has a huge bibliography. I’ve got the best editor in the world, and they’ve done a great job at Brahman Home and Academic. I live on a little lake that’s right outside my window. I feel like it’s about time I try fishing with my grandkids and taking a break.
David Capes
Yes, I think the resurrection has something to say about fishing with your grandkids!
Gary Habermas
That’s right, it’s got to be there. In John 21 we go from resurrection to fishing. So that’s the move I’m going to try to make.
David Capes
We’re looking forward to you being here with us, Gary. It’s going to be a great weekend, because we’ve got other scholars who will be here. We’ll have a panel discussion on Friday, but your main lecture is going to be November 9th, 2024. There’ll be information on our website: www.laniertheologicallibrary.org.
People can check it out. They can join us physically if they’re in their area, and if not, they can stream the lecture live or watch later on YouTube. I think it’s just such an important topic for people, from beginning to end of the Christian faith. It’s the all-in-all. We’re so grateful you’ve been with us today on The Stone Chapel Podcast to talk about this great topic, and to encourage us to come and be a part of it. We look forward to seeing you there.
Gary Habermas
Thank you very much. It’s about the third or fourth time I’ve been there, and every time, it is such a thrill. So I’m just glad to be able to see everybody again in November.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai
