Knechtle and his son Stuart, who are known for their apologetics work on college campuses and their YouTube channel Give Me an Answer, had appeared on “IMPAULSIVE” prior to Osteen. Paul told Osteen that during that conversation Knechtle kept saying, “I’m a dirty rotten sinner. That’s why part of the reason, you know, why I’m a Christian because I know my God will forgive me and I ask him for forgiveness.”
“Do you find yourself in a boat where, like, maybe you aren’t always 100% abiding by the 10 Commandments?” Paul asked Osteen.
“Yeah, Logan, I do, but I don’t dwell on it much,” Osteen answered. “And I don’t mean to sound self-righteous or like I’m perfect because I’m not. But…I get up in the morning, say, try to search my heart, ‘God, am I doing the right thing? Am I doing it for the right reason? Am I doing it for the ego?’”
“But when I can come back to that place of peace to say, ‘Ok, I believe I’m doing the right thing.’ Now, I make mistakes and you’ve got wrong thoughts and all that stuff,” Osteen continued, “but I come back to that place of peace and trust. I don’t live from a place of a ‘dirty rotten sinner.’”
“And I love Cliffe,” said Osteen, calling Knechtle “amazing,” while adding, “but I don’t live from that place. I live from a place that God has made me righteous. It wasn’t what I did. It’s what Jesus did on the cross.”
The pastor acknowledged he was born into sin but said “I don’t think it’s helpful to just say, ‘I’m no good. I’m unworthy, don’t measure up.’”
“Well, none of us did. But when Jesus came, he made us worthy. I’ve accepted his forgiveness. I still make mistakes and ask for forgiveness,” said Osteen. “But I live from a ‘God is pleased with me’ mentality. And I don’t mean that [arrogantly], and I don’t mean I’m perfect, but I think that’s better…otherwise it just pushes you down and makes you do worse.”
“It doesn’t seem like there’s a like exact science to how to be the perfect Christian,” Paul observed, “which is kind of where it’s a little interesting, and I guess the reason I’m harping on that so much is because I think there’s humanity, like a lot of humanity, in people admitting that they aren’t perfect—in fact far from it.”
“I think, by the way, that’s Cliffe’s ultimate point,” said Paul. “I think he’s—this is my opinion—I think he’s probably exaggerating a little bit to make people realize it’s okay to not be 100% right all the time.”
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“I think his ability to relay that message is obviously effective in its own way,” Paul continued, “and I think a lot of people watch him and listen to him and his son and hear the message differently, but ultimately I think the principles are the same.”
